Idea: add an optional, computable field to the Send to Location trait that will allow the module developer to specify a PlayerSide to take ownership of the card (or maybe piece, if this idea could be useful to manipulate ownership of pieces more generally).
My reason for asking for this feature is to allow a fully automated method for dealing masked cards to other players.
If you want to automate dealing masked cards to other players, I would think that “return-to-deck” to a secret face-down-deck owned by the target player and then sending it where you actually want it would do the trick? Or does that make the card owned by you?
Worth a try. Up to now, I thought drawing a card made the card owned by the PlayerSide that drew it.
If it works, you’ll need to make sure whatever send-to-location or return-to-deck takes it out of the “secret face-down owned-by-target-play” deck is outside/below the Mask trait, so that it will still be accessible when the card hopefully becomes owned by someone else.
I wasn’t aware that “private” decks had any effect on ownership. Why do you think that might be a thing?
Haha probably because I haven’t spent a lot of time thinking deeply about Mask/Ownership issues – i.e. I’m probably just wrong
I guess I should add something to a Mask trait that lets you set the owner to someone “if the owner isn’t currently set, or if the owner is you”
Dealing to a secret deck works as it removes ownership before pulling to hand. I do this a lot. Automated you don’t even know its happening from player perspective.
I dont think there is a need to adjust vassal at this time when it can already be done through nefarious creative means. More important fish to fry (v4)
Can you explain how this works? I can’t imagine a situation where the “secret deck” assigns ownership, unless the player the card being sent to triggers something to pull the card from the deck, which is an additional unnecessary step.
So, either I’m missing something, or there is an issue to address.
One thing that 3.6 will have (as of Beta 6 which may be up as soon as tomorrow i.e. Friday US time) is that Decks on publicly accessible maps (e.g. on the Main Map) can be given owners, such that only owners are allowed to drag cards out, look at what’s in the deck, use the right click menu, etc, etc.
So in other words THAT could be a pretty useful solution to the dealing-cards-out problem – e.g. there’s a “Deck” that is the “pile of cards for the British player”. So if you put cards into that (via key command or whatever), then only the British player will be able to look at them or take them out.
Meanwhile it looks pretty straightforward to add a key command to Mask to “assign ownership to as long as card is not currently owned by another player”.
I would have thought that a common scenario is a “dealer” triggering send-to-location for cards from a deck, and becoming the “owner” by doing so. Usually cards can go face up to private hands, which avoids the problem, but sometimes they have to go face down to a public board. In the latter case, the only solution I know of is to put the useless Mask trait right at the top and allow everyone to flip and peek at cards by Triggers if necessary.
If Mask is to function as intended(?) what seems to be needed is a string command in the Mask trait that can can assign PlayerSide ownership according to a beanshell input, so that, for example, a card sent to X can assign ownership to PlayerSide Y, regardless of who “owns” that card at that time.
Okay - what you describe in your second paragraph is more or less what I have checked in for 3.6 Beta 6. I think Beta 6 will release very shortly so please give this part a try and see if it will be sufficient. It will allow the current player to assign ownership to a different side (selected by an expression). The one requirement is that the card currently either be (a) unowned, or (b) belong to the current player/side – e.g. you cannot take a card already owned/masked by a third party and change its ownership.
there is no additional step. Once the card is sent to the other players hand they will become the owner - not by default - but because its in their own player hand window and as soon as they touch it they become the owner. Are you thinking it works differently? Unless you have their hand open and grab the card (if you are allowed to) I don’t see how they don’t inherit ownership. I’ve never had a problem with this
You are talking about a situation with private hands, which is not the problem under discussion.
It still works. What you do after and where is your business. The issue has always been removing ownership. That has always been the issue with card transfer between players.
Dealing cards has been viable for a long time. you just need to know how
I have had an issue with this, yes - it’s not my experience that the card becomes a player’s simply because it’s in a Player Hand that the player (side) is on the “Belongs To” list for. I do feel that I am missing something so I will happily see what I can learn from one of @Tim_M’s modules (Combat Commander, maybe ?). I will also be trying @Cattlesquat’s new feature in V3.6, so I might learn some more when I test that.
Meanwhile, this is what my example is in full:-
My set up:
a draw deck on the main map
a Player Hand for each of two sides, in which sits an off-board empty deck (out of view of the players)
Dealing a card:-
- the opponent uses a Global Key Command that triggers a Send to Location on a card in the draw deck. Target location is the Player Hand belonging to the other PlayerSide (plus Solitaire). This Player Hand is not visible to other the other side or .
- The card is masked to the opponent when it arrives (Obscured==true). My solution to this, up to now, is that the opponent presses a toolbar button that moves the new card to the empty deck and sends it back to the visible part of the Player Hand. Now the opponent owns the card and can see it.
I have not checked what happens if the card is turned face up after drawing. I didn’t want to do this because another player role (Solitaire) has access to the hand.
In summary, I think @Tim_M is suggesting a solution that I am already using, but perhaps I’ve misunderstood and there is a way to avoid the opponent taking an extra action before they can see the card
Face up cards don’t have a problem - whoever manipulates them becomes the owner. But a face down card will be unavailable to other players.
Another work-around in 3.5.8 is to have a flip card trigger and a peek trigger (that flips card twice then peeks) below the mask trait.
Dont look at Combat Commander. Look at Blood Bowl Team Manager. In this game there are shared resources (Star Players) that either side can draft. These resources require Ownership changes and can move back and forth. IIRC as I look at it now I am doing a check of the Map which determines the faction (Player). Its convoluted so may take some time to work through. As I look at it now Im having a hard time following what I was doing